Camorro declares war on Lucky 7... Or not?

[Jan]

There were many players who gave influence for the overhaul of the Clan Guidelines as well as Group Guidelines. I remember Yonno, you highly disliked the invulnerability of 'Passive Clans' and the team had made discussion for the overhaul for some time and therefore as the Clan Officers we made a change. The aim is that strictly passive 'Clans' (Now Groups) would stay groups and they would no longer be 'Immune'. Previously a Passive Clan could continue to say 'No' to any War seeing as they would have no intention to go to war however this change both separates Passive and Aggressive more clearly while ensuring that Groups are no longer Immune and there are repercussions for their actions.

In regards to the issue with 'Lucky 7' and 'Camorro' we were meant to discuss the issue on the 30th of May where we could discuss the whole situation and inform you of the planned upcoming change. Sadly my counterpart couldn't make it so the meeting was postponed. In regards to you wanting to go to war, as I previously stated 'Lucky 7' would have just continued to say 'No' so there wouldn't have been a war.

There was no bias involved in this 'change', the change has been planned for some time and sadly we will not postpone change when we can make improvements immediately.

You continue your ignorance in private and now you continue it in public aswell.

Previous rules stated: 

however the protection lasts indefinitely, or until invalidated through the clans actions

If a so called "passive" clan allies with an aggresive one, trashtalks that aggresive clan then continues acting arrogant in-character by saying "Finally", "No" and "Ooooh, I love fruits!" (which is absolutely pathetic coming from someone who's supposed to set an example by the way), they are not passive, they may not say no to a war, they'll have no other choice then accepting the roleplay. You out of all people, being a clan officer and all should know that.

I sure as hell didn't have a choice in the last war we had.. Even though I was not in the mood for a war at that time.

[god]

Pines City Vs V2D all over again. Pointless arguement the out come is obvious.

[Joe Joe]

There were many players who gave influence for the overhaul of the Clan Guidelines as well as Group Guidelines. I remember Yonno, you highly disliked the invulnerability of 'Passive Clans' and the team had made discussion for the overhaul for some time and therefore as the Clan Officers we made a change. The aim is that strictly passive 'Clans' (Now Groups) would stay groups and they would no longer be 'Immune'. Previously a Passive Clan could continue to say 'No' to any War seeing as they would have no intention to go to war however this change both separates Passive and Aggressive more clearly while ensuring that Groups are no longer Immune and there are repercussions for their actions.

In regards to the issue with 'Lucky 7' and 'Camorro' we were meant to discuss the issue on the 30th of May where we could discuss the whole situation and inform you of the planned upcoming change. Sadly my counterpart couldn't make it so the meeting was postponed. In regards to you wanting to go to war, as I previously stated 'Lucky 7' would have just continued to say 'No' so there wouldn't have been a war.

There was no bias involved in this 'change', the change has been planned for some time and sadly we will not postpone change when we can make improvements immediately.

You continue your ignorance in private and now you continue it in public aswell.

Previous rules stated: 

however the protection lasts indefinitely, or until invalidated through the clans actions

If a so called "passive" clan allies with an aggresive one, trashtalks that aggresive clan then continues acting arrogant in-character by saying "Finally", "No" and "Ooooh, I love fruits!" (which is absolutely pathetic coming from someone who's supposed to set an example by the way), they are not passive, they may not say no to a war, they'll have no other choice then accepting the roleplay. You out of all people, being a clan officer and all should know that.

I sure as hell didn't have a choice in the last war we had.. Even though I was not in the mood for a war at that time.

Making Immature comments inst an 'Act of Aggression', yes the comments could have been worded better but those comments wouldn't be a reason to go to war. They also didn't ally with you. It was a deal to make money as a business would do. The contract expired when you with drew the money and therefore you can hold nothing against them. The problem is you have left it so long to take any action and continue to see your view as valid.

You don't seem to understand the fact that you couldn't of declared war on them as a clan either seeing as they could say 'No', and why would they say yes? They haven't acted aggressively and therefore they wouldn't go to war. These changes now mean that if Groups do act aggressively against Clans then the Clans can take actions which is polar to the old system. If anything this benefits your Clan and its plan.

[Jan]

There were many players who gave influence for the overhaul of the Clan Guidelines as well as Group Guidelines. I remember Yonno, you highly disliked the invulnerability of 'Passive Clans' and the team had made discussion for the overhaul for some time and therefore as the Clan Officers we made a change. The aim is that strictly passive 'Clans' (Now Groups) would stay groups and they would no longer be 'Immune'. Previously a Passive Clan could continue to say 'No' to any War seeing as they would have no intention to go to war however this change both separates Passive and Aggressive more clearly while ensuring that Groups are no longer Immune and there are repercussions for their actions.

In regards to the issue with 'Lucky 7' and 'Camorro' we were meant to discuss the issue on the 30th of May where we could discuss the whole situation and inform you of the planned upcoming change. Sadly my counterpart couldn't make it so the meeting was postponed. In regards to you wanting to go to war, as I previously stated 'Lucky 7' would have just continued to say 'No' so there wouldn't have been a war.

There was no bias involved in this 'change', the change has been planned for some time and sadly we will not postpone change when we can make improvements immediately.

You continue your ignorance in private and now you continue it in public aswell.

Previous rules stated: 

however the protection lasts indefinitely, or until invalidated through the clans actions

If a so called "passive" clan allies with an aggresive one, trashtalks that aggresive clan then continues acting arrogant in-character by saying "Finally", "No" and "Ooooh, I love fruits!" (which is absolutely pathetic coming from someone who's supposed to set an example by the way), they are not passive, they may not say no to a war, they'll have no other choice then accepting the roleplay. You out of all people, being a clan officer and all should know that.

I sure as hell didn't have a choice in the last war we had.. Even though I was not in the mood for a war at that time.

Making Immature comments inst an 'Act of Aggression', yes the comments could have been worded better but those comments wouldn't be a reason to go to war. They also didn't ally with you. It was a deal to make money as a business would do. The contract expired when you with drew the money and therefore you can hold nothing against them. The problem is you have left it so long to take any action and continue to see your view as valid.

You don't seem to understand the fact that you couldn't of declared war on them as a clan either seeing as they could say 'No', and why would they say yes? They haven't acted aggressively and therefore they wouldn't go to war. These changes now mean that if Groups do act aggressively against Clans then the Clans can take actions which is polar to the old system. If anything this benefits your Clan and its plan.

I told you this in private aswell, but I guess your ignorance kicked it once again. The deal has nothing to do with our alliance, the money deal wasn't even supposed to be a clan thing, it was me investing in a friend because I was inactive at the time, Forgee chose to make it a clan thing was was fine at that time.

The ally is a complete differend case, it had nothing to do with the money deal, it was an alliance, but I explained that to you in private atleast three times and you failed to listen to it.

Clans do not have the right to say "no" to a war, you're simply making that up.

[Joe Joe]

-Snip-

I listened to everything you said Jan and took it all in. But can you present me with this 'Formal Alliance' then? All I have seen is a contract you both signed and that is it. All I can find is that you are 'Business Partners' which does not mean you are allies. If you can present me with a 'formal alliance' then that would assist.

[Eclipze]

So Lucky 7 is so close to getting involved in a clan war because of their IC actions and suddenly a change is made so they get absolute immunity, doesn't seem like a coincidence to me. Especially since one of the highest ranked members of Lucky 7 is also one of the clan officers. Absolutely ridiculous in my opinion...

[Joe Joe]

So Lucky 7 is so close to getting involved in a clan war because of their IC actions and suddenly a change is made so they get absolute immunity, doesn't seem like a coincidence to me. Especially since one of the highest ranked members of Lucky 7 is also one of the clan officers. Absolutely ridiculous in my opinion...

No, if the guidelines were read you can now see that there are no longer immune. People actually need to read the new guidelines to understand. As a clan Lucky 7 were immune, now everyone is responsible for their actions.

[Jan]

So Lucky 7 is so close to getting involved in a clan war because of their IC actions and suddenly a change is made so they get absolute immunity, doesn't seem like a coincidence to me. Especially since one of the highest ranked members of Lucky 7 is also one of the clan officers. Absolutely ridiculous in my opinion...

No, if the guidelines were read you can now see that there are no longer immune. People actually need to read the new guidelines to understand. As a clan Lucky 7 were immune, now everyone is responsible for their actions.

however the protection lasts indefinitely, or until invalidated through the clans actions

"I listened to everything you said Jan and took it all in", yet two replies later you once again claim they were immune.

[Dragnort_]

Honestly this is all just a shit show.
People can't abide by their actions and need to protect themselves.

[JoshZ]

So what you're saying is that groups can no longer go to war? If so that is fucking stupid as shit.