The staff team

[Zona]

Applications suck, Anybody can make themselves look good on pen and paper, or in this instance, a Staff Application.

Of course, but you won't get accepted just because the application looks good. They will specate you both ingame, discord and on the forums. If yo break the rules or doesn't fit the team, then you won't get accepted. 

I don't see how hard it is to understand that they will still go though their current protocols and won't just accept the application because it looks good. Don't make up problems which wont be there.

[Random]

Applications suck, Anybody can make themselves look good on pen and paper, or in this instance, a Staff Application.

Of course, but you won't get accepted just because the application looks good. They will specate you both ingame, discord and on the forums. If yo break the rules or doesn't fit the team, then you won't get accepted. 

I don't see how hard it is to understand that they will still go though their current protocols and won't just accept the application because it looks good. Don't make up problems which wont be there.

But then they can just act like on their best behaviour in game aswell? That's what teacher applicants did, they were all ''Goodboys'' (Me included, don't get me wrong..) when their application was up, if it was denied, straight back to how they were. 

Applications are POINTLESS. Let the team decide.

[Aryen]

-snip-

What's so bad about behaving different and good once you've applied? There's tons of minges and trolls who simply mature and become decent roleplayers. Behaving good is simply showing how mature you are, even if it's fake it doesn't really matter, as long as they do what they're supposed to and enforce the rules. As you stated, that's what you did aswell, that doesn't mean you were a bad staff member. If their applications get accepted and they're not behaving so nice anymore, they get demoted it's really that simple.

[JackZ]

Only people who want to become a staff member want applications because it makes it easier for them.

Play ball with the way people who want staff have been for years, Prove your worth to be picked rather than register interest via an application.

[Prosto]

Let me try to explain why applications wont work.

First of all, its not about simply banning minges, surely if staff job was just banning massive propkillers, 90% of community could become staff. It also involves working with people, dealing with somewhat stressful situations. Its involves talking to people, investigating(sort of), and being as unbiased as possible.

Now lets imagine apps do get added. Everyone will start posting applications, and what happens next? How do you know who is capable/trustworthy etc etc? Short answer - You cant. Why? Simply because as soon as player post application they become "exceptional player" good behaviour etc. They know they are being watched, they know that if they want to become staff they need to behave well. You are delusional if you dont understand it.

Players behave completly different in natural environment, this allows staff to pick people judging by their actions not words like "Hi I love FL and RP I be good I promise"

Surely you can say but people still asslick without applications. They do, but during my time on FL I met only 3 or 4 people who became admin via blatant asslicking. Guess what 2 of them didnt even pass trial/mod stage. Trust me, asslicking is VERY obvious, especially if its massive.

But there are already biased admins! - Maybe you are right, but still its not as massive as it would be if applications existed.

One last time, Applications simply will not work. People will change behaviour. You dont know if you can trust said people. You dont know if those people are biased or not. Staff job is not only about typing out "!ban %username% 5days propkilling" if it was only that, it would be completly different story
Thanks.

[Andrew Juniperfield]

As trust and reliance are quite important, just letting people in based on an application and then a trial period wouldnt be very healthy.
Staff lashing out in one way or another leading to community destruction has happened before, being selective and careful when picking staff has a reason behind it. Anyone can look good for lets say a month only to get power.

Its not a long term solution and would cause a disturbance of structure in the long run. I dont see opening applications as a solution to the problem at all.

Even admins who just hunger for power and dont really teach people stuff and never being demoted or properly recieving exposure for their actions (as its not technically against the admins duties), have appeared throughout the years (dont feel like any exist at this time). If these, in my opinion, bad admins get through the current system, I dont think opening applications would make people more happy.

[Kahjo]

Just leaving this here for no specific reaspn, just because the thread title, I haven't read any messages but.

YO WE'RE THE FEARLESS TEAM BANNING ALL DAY KEEP THE SERVERS CLEAN MMHMHM.... YO MY NAME IS JAN YOU JUST BROKE A RULE SO HERES A NICE BAN!! YO MY NAME IS.... MMHMM..

[Aspire]

I reckon the staff team put butter on chocolate spread and toast

[JackZ]

Let me try to explain why applications wont work.

First of all, its not about simply banning minges, surely if staff job was just banning massive propkillers, 90% of community could become staff. It also involves working with people, dealing with somewhat stressful situations. Its involves talking to people, investigating(sort of), and being as unbiased as possible.

Now lets imagine apps do get added. Everyone will start posting applications, and what happens next? How do you know who is capable/trustworthy etc etc? Short answer - You cant. Why? Simply because as soon as player post application they become "exceptional player" good behaviour etc. They know they are being watched, they know that if they want to become staff they need to behave well. You are delusional if you dont understand it.

Players behave completly different in natural environment, this allows staff to pick people judging by their actions not words like "Hi I love FL and RP I be good I promise"

Surely you can say but people still asslick without applications. They do, but during my time on FL I met only 3 or 4 people who became admin via blatant asslicking. Guess what 2 of them didnt even pass trial/mod stage. Trust me, asslicking is VERY obvious, especially if its massive.

But there are already biased admins! - Maybe you are right, but still its not as massive as it would be if applications existed.

One last time, Applications simply will not work. People will change behaviour. You dont know if you can trust said people. You dont know if those people are biased or not. Staff job is not only about typing out "!ban %username% 5days propkilling" if it was only that, it would be completly different story
Thanks.

The Ukrainian mad man puts it best.

[BasicallyMental]

Let me try to explain why applications wont work.

First of all, its not about simply banning minges, surely if staff job was just banning massive propkillers, 90% of community could become staff. It also involves working with people, dealing with somewhat stressful situations. Its involves talking to people, investigating(sort of), and being as unbiased as possible.

Now lets imagine apps do get added. Everyone will start posting applications, and what happens next? How do you know who is capable/trustworthy etc etc? Short answer - You cant. Why? Simply because as soon as player post application they become "exceptional player" good behaviour etc. They know they are being watched, they know that if they want to become staff they need to behave well. You are delusional if you dont understand it.

Players behave completly different in natural environment, this allows staff to pick people judging by their actions not words like "Hi I love FL and RP I be good I promise"

Surely you can say but people still asslick without applications. They do, but during my time on FL I met only 3 or 4 people who became admin via blatant asslicking. Guess what 2 of them didnt even pass trial/mod stage. Trust me, asslicking is VERY obvious, especially if its massive.

But there are already biased admins! - Maybe you are right, but still its not as massive as it would be if applications existed.

One last time, Applications simply will not work. People will change behaviour. You dont know if you can trust said people. You dont know if those people are biased or not. Staff job is not only about typing out "!ban %username% 5days propkilling" if it was only that, it would be completly different story
Thanks.

If you can do me one favour then sir, come up with a solution that is going to fix the fact the staff team do not bother coming on the server. If you even so say "Give them time to become active", "Things will/are being done", "they have lives" then ima have to spank you because all of this shit has been said, three months ago they said they would sort it but nothing has happened. And, i don't know if you've read other replies or threads, but them having a life preventing them coming on the server is an extremely half assed excuse. If they have something else better to be doing than administrating on FL at least once a week for a couple hours then leave the position to allow for someone else to come and fulfil the job correctly. I understand it is voluntary, however, if you're a volunteer at your local charity shop but never work there then you would leave would you not? As you cannot give up the time for them.

Another argument you may say is that it's not about letting go, we just need to increase the size of the staff team. What is the point in having a large staff team? I would rather a staff team of 7 people who are actively doing their job than a staff team of 20 who come on when they can be bothered, whip out their ego and act biased.

Ya know, it might just do the server some good to have some people tryharding, actually learning the rules. We might have a little more success in defeating the minges that way.

You are the same as everyone else, you overlook the fact an application does not just get accepted. There is a period a player is monitored and most players i can guarentee with get bored with being the good guy, go back to their old ways and have their application denied. Does this then defeat the point in applications? Not at all because it's only a small majority that would do it. They do not just go straight into a trial period, there is so much more to it than that. Just because an application is posted does not then require that candidate to follow through with it, or the requirements.

As for your point on asslicking people getting admin, you're fairly right in the fact asslickers don't get admin. It's the admin's friends. Either way, it is a very specific audience that get admin through a very, very, very biased system.

One thing i've also noticed is that it is all of the inactive members of the community, people who don't play only making an occasional comment on the forums, that are against applications because you have no idea about the modern staff team. Come and join the server for a week, put up with what we do with absolutely no admins on, then give us another solution to fixing the issue.