New Map? - Discussion

[Avgar]

The Ranox building interiors look like something you'd see shitty Minecraft builders make - way too open and huge. Because of this I feel like I could not fully immerse myself, since you'd feel like a toy in a toy house. Unfortunately, I've so far not seen any maps, other than EvoCity, with at least somewhat realistic interiors.

If frames is what the goal of map changing is about, for the love of SoulRippah, please do not release a map without load testing it first with the gamemode. Changing maps hurts the server a lot, it's a big risk. Changing back because of performance issues hurts it even more.

Lastly, on the topic of performance again - source engine is not designed for huge open maps. It's pretty much impossible to get great frames on it. Try this:
1. Unsubscribe from all addons, remove all content
2. Launch Garry's Mod on any open map
3. Turn on FPS counter
4. Spawn as many bots as you can
5. Feel your frames drop the more bots you spawn

There's only 3 things to do about bad performance, 2 for devs and 1 for players:
1. Edit/buy/get a map to be less open. I know, it sucks, but having a huge open city takes it's toll.
2. Run FProfiler to figure out if any newer updates has caused server to lag. This is best done with many players online. I've used this method to figure out license plates as well as door texts causing lag in the past.
3. For the player - drop all your settings except model quality to the lowest you can. The difference is really substantial.

[[LT] Sparx]

[Dimitris]

Lastly, on the topic of performance again - source engine is not designed for huge open maps. 

V2D

[Coffee]

After further looking into Ranox City I dont believe it would be a good move for FL, the frames were actually worse than V4B1 on Singleplayer and most buildings are already pre-furnished.

Most of the props can be removed as they're world props, a lot of the buildings are also empty anyway for dupes. No map will magically give you all amazing FPS, so I don't think it should be a major consideration (not saying completely ignore it, just there isn't much you can do with just a map). The FPS on Ranox seemed to be fine with the FL gamemode too with a few people on, I think it's slightly better than V4B1.

Most of them are not world props, the hotel and the apartments both have props in the rooms that cannot be removed without editing the map its self. Making it impossible to decorate the room your self.

This is under 10 props and hides all the world props in any of the penthouse suites without blocking access to any of the windows that give it such a nice view etc, sure it's a bit annoying that you can't use all the space, but it's definitely not at all IMPOSSIBLE to decorate it yourself:

V4B1 and other evocity maps still have much better interiors, that are easy to decorate and have suitable props that don't get in the way. Most of the buildings are way too big and I can just image people blocking half them off as they don't have enough props to make a decent interior, which is just a waste if there are better maps out there.

Although some people want something new, but new isn't always better. The evo city maps are tried and tested, they have a good level of realism and decent decoration making a good city atmosphere. There is a good mix of buildings and peoples dupes will tend to transfer quite well as many of the buildings are the same. Chaos city is a much better bet, if its performance is decent.

[[LT] Sparx]

After further looking into Ranox City I dont believe it would be a good move for FL, the frames were actually worse than V4B1 on Singleplayer and most buildings are already pre-furnished.

Most of the props can be removed as they're world props, a lot of the buildings are also empty anyway for dupes. No map will magically give you all amazing FPS, so I don't think it should be a major consideration (not saying completely ignore it, just there isn't much you can do with just a map). The FPS on Ranox seemed to be fine with the FL gamemode too with a few people on, I think it's slightly better than V4B1.

Most of them are not world props, the hotel and the apartments both have props in the rooms that cannot be removed without editing the map its self. Making it impossible to decorate the room your self.

This is under 10 props and hides all the world props in any of the penthouse suites without blocking access to any of the windows that give it such a nice view etc, sure it's a bit annoying that you can't use all the space, but it's definitely not at all IMPOSSIBLE to decorate it yourself:

V4B1 and other evocity maps still have much better interiors, that are easy to decorate and have suitable props that don't get in the way. Most of the buildings are way too big and I can just image people blocking half them off as they don't have enough props to make a decent interior, which is just a waste if there are better maps out there.

Although some people want something new, but new isn't always better. The evo city maps are tried and tested, they have a good level of realism and decent decoration making a good city atmosphere. There is a good mix of buildings and peoples dupes will tend to transfer quite well as many of the buildings are the same. Chaos city is a much better bet, if its performance is decent.

Give me some examples of 'much better' interiors from the Evocity maps that are easy to decorate?

If the only issue you can find with a map is that people are going to (maybe) use props to block parts of interiors off, then the map doesn't really have many issues.

[Awestruck]

If frames is what the goal of map changing is about, for the love of SoulRippah, please do not release a map without load testing it first with the gamemode. Changing maps hurts the server a lot, it's a big risk. Changing back because of performance issues hurts it even more.

Lastly, on the topic of performance again - source engine is not designed for huge open maps. It's pretty much impossible to get great frames on it. Try this:
1. Unsubscribe from all addons, remove all content
2. Launch Garry's Mod on any open map
3. Turn on FPS counter
4. Spawn as many bots as you can
5. Feel your frames drop the more bots you spawn

There's only 3 things to do about bad performance, 2 for devs and 1 for players:
1. Edit/buy/get a map to be less open. I know, it sucks, but having a huge open city takes it's toll.
2. Run FProfiler to figure out if any newer updates has caused server to lag. This is best done with many players online. I've used this method to figure out license plates as well as door texts causing lag in the past.
3. For the player - drop all your settings except model quality to the lowest you can. The difference is really substantial.

[SpaghettiFTW]

rp_EvoCity_DBG_190415 Looks a mixture of what everyone wants https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f...1713732887

[Joe Joe]

rp_EvoCity_DBG_190415 Looks a mixture of what everyone wants https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/f...1713732887

You know what that map is actually quite nice and I would highly suggest people checking it out. A mix of 2 good maps with features such as no indoor non-removable world props. Feels fresh yet nostalgic at the same time.

[Forgee]

After further looking into Ranox City I dont believe it would be a good move for FL, the frames were actually worse than V4B1 on Singleplayer and most buildings are already pre-furnished.

Which buildings specifically?

Here's a small compilation of empty/extremely minimally furnished interiors on Ranox:

as for frames, I had far worse frames on singleplayer Pines V2 than I did when it was on the server, so I think it's hugely down to your addons etc.

almost every apartment has furnishing, also the map is horrifically optimised, there is almost no occlusion culling at all.
also there is only a small handful of shops. 

Also there is a Jail that you cannot enter from the outside as there is only a button on the inside and the Jail itself is a solid 2 minute drive from the police station

[[LT] Sparx]

After further looking into Ranox City I dont believe it would be a good move for FL, the frames were actually worse than V4B1 on Singleplayer and most buildings are already pre-furnished.

Which buildings specifically?

Here's a small compilation of empty/extremely minimally furnished interiors on Ranox:

as for frames, I had far worse frames on singleplayer Pines V2 than I did when it was on the server, so I think it's hugely down to your addons etc.

almost every apartment has furnishing, also the map is horrifically optimised, there is almost no occlusion culling at all.
also there is only a small handful of shops. 

Also there is a Jail that you cannot enter from the outside as there is only a button on the inside and the Jail itself is a solid 2 minute drive from the police station

Since when have you seen more than 6 shops used at the same time?

As for apartment furnishing, I posted a video above of how easy it is to cover up even the most pre-furnished apartments easily.

As for the jail, 2 minutes is a stretch, it's practically right next to it