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04-11-2018, 02:02 PM
(This post was last modified: 09-01-2022, 01:06 AM by Fearless Community.
Edit Reason: Fixed Encoding
)
1. Arrest times for more than 15 minutes.
This is a major issue and it stems from detachment of the president from the police force. It is worth noting that arrest warrants are sometimes made longer because everyone knows that when criminals leave jail they just reoffend again so putting them in jail for longer is just a way of giving the city some form of security from crime. I'm not supporting the act of 15 minute arrests, but it does limit the amount of time you have to arrest a person. For example, sometimes I arrest the same person 3 or 4 times for similar things because they just won't stop no matter how many times you arrest them and the 15 minutes gives me a break from them.
2. Unrealistic police.
Okay, this one is an easy one to support. One thing I would note is that FearRP should be adjusted to make people scared of a police officer during a traffic stop, I don't like to point my pistol at a window during a pull over but it is the only way to get someone to leave the vehicle without them driving off. This is obviously in some ways my fault for not even trying to order someone to step out without my pistol but otherwise people will pretty much ignore you and it's something you just do from experience. Overall I agree but the there is a reason police point weapons at you constantly during stops, maybe we should address that reason rather than treating the symptom of it.
3. Remove locker advantage.
Right, this is gonna be a long one :p . Before I start I want to make something clear, I play as police commonly so I do have a bias towards them as you may have guessed but I have played as criminal quite a bit in the past (though not as much as a lot of you). So looking at it from the criminal perspective, free weapons is awful, police can just shoot me over and over again without fear of losing anything and they still get paid at the end of the day. From the police perspective free weapons is great, I can get shot, grab new weapons, and be back in after 10 minutes of patrolling.
Now from my perspective this is again just a symptom of a bigger problem, I don't believe big shoot outs should happen (at the very least, not to the extent that they do now). My view comes from the fact that the whole idea of a criminal (rebel/Corleone) on Fearless seems to be very wrong.
Criminals don't build bases with 10 foot walls, they don't have military grade weapons (at least not where I come from), this isn't just semi-unrealistic, it's total fantasy. Rebels are meant to be the disorganized bunch of low level criminals who might be involved in the drug trade at the lowest level, Corleones are meant to be the high level criminals who own the drug trade, they bribe high level officials to turn a blind eye and generally get involved in a more political side of criminality, i.e. trying to win the people over either through fear, or through treating them better than the government. This is so far from what happens in the game that it's laughable, rebels and Corleones are interchangeable in game and tend to share the same agenda of fighting as much as possible while making as much money as possible. If criminals acted as "underground" jobs are meant to then they wouldn't need military grade weaponry and neither would the police.
I think the reasons for the misinterpretation of criminality on fearless is caused by the contraband system and the mentality of the community.
The contraband system is awful, all you have to do is place down some weird looking machine and magically, money appears out of nowhere! Drug labs should produce drugs, money printers shouldn't exist, I won't get too detailed into this to avoid going too far off topic but the basic idea of being able to sit in an area for a certain about of time and have money appear is just dumb, more over it doesn't effect everyday citizens as criminality does in real life. In real life a criminal act is criminal because it hurts society or members of a society in some way, for example, drugs cause problems with addiction (and premature death) which limits the ability of a person to work (and/or pay tax), having a person not work or pay tax hurts society as others have to make up the lost revenue through higher taxes. In EvoCity, tax doesn't matter to anyone, drugs/contraband don't matter to anyone, and addiction doesn't exist. No one liking or disliking the criminals causes them to just exist, no one knows why the police want to destroy the contraband it's just a fact of Evocity that doesn't get questioned, why should police stop people producing contraband if they only get a fraction of the money made by it, they may as well let them continue as it doesn't bring harm to people and they don't die trying to destroy it. My point here is that if contraband took away something, such as income, from the people of Evocity then it would actually give people, including citizens, a reason to want it destroyed.
Now, the mentality of the community. This community right now is focused on aggressive roleplay which is thinly veiled by the excuse of having passive areas and jobs. It should be pretty obvious to anyone who was on yesterday evening(10/04/2018) that this is true, when two gangs turned the inner city (a public area) into a war zone. Playing a police officer commonly I find it's impossible to go more than two minutes without a shots fired call going out or coming under fire myself, this is not addressed by admins at all and even following rule changes AggressiveRP continues on a higher level than ever. I haven't been able to do proper passive policing in a busy server for a long time, and it really is destroying other passive roleplays when the police can't respond to them because we're all busy at a raid while they have a random citizen harassing them, mugging them, or stealing their car. If police can't respond to those calls on a regular basis then it defeats the whole point of the police, we may as well be an extension of SRU. My point here: AggressiveRP groups run the server, police may as well be a paramilitary organisation at this point.
So finally onto the issue you raised. Police need free guns right now, police are generally always the aggressors in engagement, if criminals had to commonly raid the nexus then maybe I would agree with you but they don't and police have to raid strong defenses. The only times when police aren't the aggressors is generally when they get shot during a traffic stop without warning, this would be an annoying thing for anyone if we also lost $4000 in gear - imagine being a criminal and being shot when you get out your car and losing your gear, pretty dumb. Criminals on the other hand do not have any other responsibilities, they generally are completely defensive giving them a massive advantage over the police. Now I can agree with criminals getting free weapons IF they are limited to weapons that suit their role, i.e. mac10s, glocks. Seeing criminals use advanced weaponry while in a gang is just painful. If you limit the weapons on criminals then maybe police can go back to just having USPs with the SRU also having similar limitations. There is also a more direct, simple solution to this - surrender, the mentality of a WWII imperial Japanese soldier is admirable but unrealistic - you don't want to lose your weapons? spend 15 minutes in jail instead. This is a basic system that should happen in the game but instead criminals have the death before dishonour mentality which limits roleplay and promotes AggressiveRP.
In conclusion, while free weapons give the police an advantage, this is limited by the criminal's defensive bonus. Criminals have a way out with all their weapons while fighting police but often refuse to use it. I think this issue is just an effect of ridiculous criminal expectations and criminal systems - such as contraband, as well as a rampant aggressive mentality in the community which is ignored or excused by many members.
4. Make arrests ooc again.
Yes, I think the admins should be able to deal with this as staff numbers and activity seem to be increasing.
P.s. Apologies for the poor writing, somehow they let me in at A-level ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
This is a major issue and it stems from detachment of the president from the police force. It is worth noting that arrest warrants are sometimes made longer because everyone knows that when criminals leave jail they just reoffend again so putting them in jail for longer is just a way of giving the city some form of security from crime. I'm not supporting the act of 15 minute arrests, but it does limit the amount of time you have to arrest a person. For example, sometimes I arrest the same person 3 or 4 times for similar things because they just won't stop no matter how many times you arrest them and the 15 minutes gives me a break from them.
2. Unrealistic police.
Okay, this one is an easy one to support. One thing I would note is that FearRP should be adjusted to make people scared of a police officer during a traffic stop, I don't like to point my pistol at a window during a pull over but it is the only way to get someone to leave the vehicle without them driving off. This is obviously in some ways my fault for not even trying to order someone to step out without my pistol but otherwise people will pretty much ignore you and it's something you just do from experience. Overall I agree but the there is a reason police point weapons at you constantly during stops, maybe we should address that reason rather than treating the symptom of it.
3. Remove locker advantage.
Right, this is gonna be a long one :p . Before I start I want to make something clear, I play as police commonly so I do have a bias towards them as you may have guessed but I have played as criminal quite a bit in the past (though not as much as a lot of you). So looking at it from the criminal perspective, free weapons is awful, police can just shoot me over and over again without fear of losing anything and they still get paid at the end of the day. From the police perspective free weapons is great, I can get shot, grab new weapons, and be back in after 10 minutes of patrolling.
Now from my perspective this is again just a symptom of a bigger problem, I don't believe big shoot outs should happen (at the very least, not to the extent that they do now). My view comes from the fact that the whole idea of a criminal (rebel/Corleone) on Fearless seems to be very wrong.
Criminals don't build bases with 10 foot walls, they don't have military grade weapons (at least not where I come from), this isn't just semi-unrealistic, it's total fantasy. Rebels are meant to be the disorganized bunch of low level criminals who might be involved in the drug trade at the lowest level, Corleones are meant to be the high level criminals who own the drug trade, they bribe high level officials to turn a blind eye and generally get involved in a more political side of criminality, i.e. trying to win the people over either through fear, or through treating them better than the government. This is so far from what happens in the game that it's laughable, rebels and Corleones are interchangeable in game and tend to share the same agenda of fighting as much as possible while making as much money as possible. If criminals acted as "underground" jobs are meant to then they wouldn't need military grade weaponry and neither would the police.
I think the reasons for the misinterpretation of criminality on fearless is caused by the contraband system and the mentality of the community.
The contraband system is awful, all you have to do is place down some weird looking machine and magically, money appears out of nowhere! Drug labs should produce drugs, money printers shouldn't exist, I won't get too detailed into this to avoid going too far off topic but the basic idea of being able to sit in an area for a certain about of time and have money appear is just dumb, more over it doesn't effect everyday citizens as criminality does in real life. In real life a criminal act is criminal because it hurts society or members of a society in some way, for example, drugs cause problems with addiction (and premature death) which limits the ability of a person to work (and/or pay tax), having a person not work or pay tax hurts society as others have to make up the lost revenue through higher taxes. In EvoCity, tax doesn't matter to anyone, drugs/contraband don't matter to anyone, and addiction doesn't exist. No one liking or disliking the criminals causes them to just exist, no one knows why the police want to destroy the contraband it's just a fact of Evocity that doesn't get questioned, why should police stop people producing contraband if they only get a fraction of the money made by it, they may as well let them continue as it doesn't bring harm to people and they don't die trying to destroy it. My point here is that if contraband took away something, such as income, from the people of Evocity then it would actually give people, including citizens, a reason to want it destroyed.
Now, the mentality of the community. This community right now is focused on aggressive roleplay which is thinly veiled by the excuse of having passive areas and jobs. It should be pretty obvious to anyone who was on yesterday evening(10/04/2018) that this is true, when two gangs turned the inner city (a public area) into a war zone. Playing a police officer commonly I find it's impossible to go more than two minutes without a shots fired call going out or coming under fire myself, this is not addressed by admins at all and even following rule changes AggressiveRP continues on a higher level than ever. I haven't been able to do proper passive policing in a busy server for a long time, and it really is destroying other passive roleplays when the police can't respond to them because we're all busy at a raid while they have a random citizen harassing them, mugging them, or stealing their car. If police can't respond to those calls on a regular basis then it defeats the whole point of the police, we may as well be an extension of SRU. My point here: AggressiveRP groups run the server, police may as well be a paramilitary organisation at this point.
So finally onto the issue you raised. Police need free guns right now, police are generally always the aggressors in engagement, if criminals had to commonly raid the nexus then maybe I would agree with you but they don't and police have to raid strong defenses. The only times when police aren't the aggressors is generally when they get shot during a traffic stop without warning, this would be an annoying thing for anyone if we also lost $4000 in gear - imagine being a criminal and being shot when you get out your car and losing your gear, pretty dumb. Criminals on the other hand do not have any other responsibilities, they generally are completely defensive giving them a massive advantage over the police. Now I can agree with criminals getting free weapons IF they are limited to weapons that suit their role, i.e. mac10s, glocks. Seeing criminals use advanced weaponry while in a gang is just painful. If you limit the weapons on criminals then maybe police can go back to just having USPs with the SRU also having similar limitations. There is also a more direct, simple solution to this - surrender, the mentality of a WWII imperial Japanese soldier is admirable but unrealistic - you don't want to lose your weapons? spend 15 minutes in jail instead. This is a basic system that should happen in the game but instead criminals have the death before dishonour mentality which limits roleplay and promotes AggressiveRP.
In conclusion, while free weapons give the police an advantage, this is limited by the criminal's defensive bonus. Criminals have a way out with all their weapons while fighting police but often refuse to use it. I think this issue is just an effect of ridiculous criminal expectations and criminal systems - such as contraband, as well as a rampant aggressive mentality in the community which is ignored or excused by many members.
4. Make arrests ooc again.
Yes, I think the admins should be able to deal with this as staff numbers and activity seem to be increasing.
P.s. Apologies for the poor writing, somehow they let me in at A-level ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
![[Image: hyPcnFC.png]](https://i.imgur.com/hyPcnFC.png)