serious fl discussion ideas

[Awestruck]

littletown would kinda sound fun at this point

I'm madly in love with you

[Boonan]

The "best" and "community favourite" often has no correlation on FL.
That is unfortunately the honest truth.


Having a map like v2d would tremendously help Wolven, and everyone else populate the server faster.

I think there's a needless stigma against v2d right now -
the map seems like a logical choice for the predicament FL is in at the moment.

It could be easier to get the ball rolling on a smaller map like v2d, as it generates more player interaction.

V2D would be nice for nostalgia but it's also a very controversial map which meant it'd be very risky for us to swap to it, it also really not that small with it often feeling much bigger than V4B1 due to it not looping. Siphon has a side-by-side comparison somewhere showing that it's actually the same size if not bigger than V4B1, especially when it comes to driving distances. V4B1 was the safe pick with almost everyone voting for it which is why we went to it, it also has things such as event boxes which makes it easier for the EC team to host events on main - something which I'm sure you'll agree is very vital right now.
generates more player interaction.

What makes the map better suited - is the city area that is significantly more congested. I agree events are important, but the event box is a luxury that can't compete with more frequent player interaction.

I think Wolven, Boonan and everyone else helping populate the server would greatly benefit from a more congested city.

I do find it odd that a few of you were at first telling us to swap to V2D as it's what the community wanted, and now that we've swapped to V4B1 (as it turns out the community wanted V4B1) we're being told to ignore what the community wants and go V2D. I don't think there's any way to exactly please everyone here when it comes to the map which is why switching yet again is probably pointless, it's easier to just stay on the map everyone likes or at the very least doesn't mind. I also really do hate the focus on the map, I thought we concluded a while back that the map is just used as a scapegoat for pretty much every other issue?

Well, I think we should consider the current situation, and try to look for changes that can help FL. I wouldn't consider changing to v2d a final solution to FL´s problems - I would rather consider it a helping hand for our most dedicated members - those who spend those monotonous hours trying to kickstart the server.

we were looking into was some sort of nostalgia night where we do swap to V2D and an old version of the gamemode on the event server for a bit. If we do end up giving up or once FL is a bit more stable we'll look into finishing that up as it'd be nice.

This sounds like a great event. I like it

EDIT: I'd actually like to ask you something, do you genuinely believe V2D would significantly help with FLs situation? I would agree that it'd have short term nostalgia, but we'll likely be on it for a while. We've seen V2D in the past do very well for about a week before completely dying off, do you think it'll be different this time?

Changing to v2d could help them retain a larger amount of players to get a bigger ball rolling.

But I don't think it would change FL´s more longterm player problems.


If people like Wolven get bored of kickstarting the server, it won't matter what map FL is running. If nobody is there, nobody will play.

V2d won't solve FL´s big problems - that's clear -
but I do think it could help our most dedicated members get more traction in their kickstarting.

Thinking about it what you said about V2D getting a bigger ball rolling does make a lot of sense, to play off the nostalgia with updates events etc to stop people getting bored of kickstarting the server but it would have to be executed perfectly for it to work otherwise I don't think there will be a recovery.

"Perfectly executed"
This is the current issue. People are losing faith in FL, the server has 1 player, and y'all are waiting for the perfect moment... I wonder when that is, if it's not now..

Because the player count isn't at a decent level, that doesn't mean the team will drop their standards - high standards will be maintained in everything we do. So yes we will wait for the opportune moment to release something instead of just dropping it out once its ready without adequate testing / tweaks.

[Jan]

Kind reminder for the ones that forgot, people like Nadrick joined the staff team end 2011/start 2012, at that time there were 3 servers that were always full.

Yet you’re talking about maintaining high standards when, and I really don’t mean to offend you, you barely experienced one full server for more then 2 weeks. The “standards” you’re talking about are the reason the server is dead, do something, try something. But stop talking like everything is going perfect, it’s the opposite and you know that.

[Self]

Well, surely a simple sentence such as quality over quancity havnt crossed their minds.
Surely, it has nothing to do with the fact that the two people promoted were playing League of Legends with Pollux & co (which im really good at myself btw, mid main peak grandmaster).
With a weak owner who is by the looks, readily swayed and has acquired critical thinking to an limited degree for unknown reasons? Age/experience maybe a variable.
There's simply no point anymore. The argument/talking with community stage, is long over due. 
Let us appreciate what is left for as long as we can.

Are you referring to me in the first half of this? I prefer to stay out of 'the spotlight' and avoid posting things in threads like this with little thought, opting instead to play on the server and work with my team to make a difference, which was especially noticed by the team while I was an event coordinator and event manager the past 21 months. If Pollux was just promoting friends to management, I wouldn't have this opportunity right now, as my relationship with him has been very cold for the past 2 years, so don't make assumptions.

We can all agree that FL is in a really sad state at the minute and I completely agree with what Jan has to say regarding attitude, the only way somethings going to change is if we do something. The events team have been a shining example this month and have worked hard to deliver events even though they have no guarantee whatsoever that anyone will show up to them. Hopefully we can continue this effort into October as the Halloween season is great for fun event ideas. Events alone wont revive the server, I know this, we all know this, we need to get all of FL’s cogs running again, and new innovative cogs added to thrust the server into a stable future. It’s really awesome to see so many people contributing to this thread who’ve been around for so many years, and it’s a fact that everyone who’s still here cares for the server, each giving their own ideas on how to keep it alive. This is a fact that’s often forgotten during the arguments that are inevitable on these kinds of threads when ideas clash, and it’s hard to know for sure which ideas are going to work.

Currently my only idea for development is to tweak and update every system that was just added to the server as frankly there are problems with some of them (contraband system, leaves new members confused or bored) and they feel somewhat redundant or unfinished (in my opinion, dynamic economy delivery system). When we’ve got that sorted we can start marching ahead with some of the great ideas community members have given on the survey, and continue to promote higher quality roleplay with the events team.

My current thinking is this: events bring around 25 players for the duration of the event, and then player count drops to 0 when the event is over. If event coordinators focus on various roleplays (roleplays and mini events but NOT focusing on big events) then perhaps a stable 10-15 players can be achieved. When the tweaks for the updates are rolled out, the server will be much more enjoyable and perhaps we could see a consistent 25 players at peak time without events, as players will enjoy doing contraband which in turn promotes government etc. Then, throw an event on top of this and maybe we could hit 50 players again. Then along with updates that the majority of the community want, perhaps we can restore the player base. This sort of thing was achieved temporarily by the events team, friends and I earlier this year by focusing on roleplay before events.

Apologies that this is so long, and I should just note that my DMs on discord are always open and I’d be more than happy to hear from people there

[aDisabledDeer]

Kind reminder for the ones that forgot, people like Nadrick joined the staff team end 2011/start 2012, at that time there were 3 servers that were always full.

Yet you’re talking about maintaining high standards when, and I really don’t mean to offend you, you barely experienced one full server for more then 2 weeks. The “standards” you’re talking about are the reason the server is dead, do something, try something. But stop talking like everything is going perfect, it’s the opposite and you know that.

Jan is absolutely right, there was 1 person active on a Friday and Saturday evening when I checked on those days. The server playerbase has collapsed and you need to do something about it, and do it quickly.

Quick fixes I can think of;
- revert back to V2d, can be done quickly and why not, it's not like anybody is playing the current map anyway
- change the contraband system back to the old system and I would even go as far as to say the entire UI and shop infrastructure, more doesn't equal better and sometimes keeping it simple is easier
- organising big events doesn't help retain players, get people more active from the team with RPs in the server and forum posts
- drop the price of donator, make it affordable, the cheaper it is the more likely people are to buy it and if they buy it they will use it

I went back on the server the other day and came off after 10 minutes because I wasn't a fan of the new UI, chat, F1 menu or shop system because it isn't simple. Something to keep in mind I guess if you want older players back. It currently feels like a darkrp server trying to be a roleplay server because of the ui and because there is just so much excess junk in the buy menu

You have to do something and do it fast or just like many other roleplay communities including limelight there wont be a fearless community for much longer

[Generation]

I hate to say this but the question need to be ask (like in a business): what will bring a player on the server and will keep an attraction, and keep him back ?
This require to have a "Product Manager": once again , we talk about marketing.
This person carries out the synthesis of market studies, competition productions and customer expectations in order to anticipate the needs of potential donations. This information allows him to implement the service and launch strategy by following the "four P's" rule: product (service), price, promotion, place.

For this, the Product Manager need to studies the market (connecting to others roleplay servers and list pros/cons), analyzes the competition to best meet players expectations.

Can't help you more.

[gin]

I hate to say this but the question need to be ask (like in a business): what will bring a player on the server and will keep an attraction, and keep him back ?
This require to have a "Product Manager": once again , we talk about marketing.
This person carries out the synthesis of market studies, competition productions and customer expectations in order to anticipate the needs of potential donations. This information allows him to implement the service and launch strategy by following the "four P's" rule: product (service), price, promotion, place.

For this, the Product Manager need to studies the market (connecting to others roleplay servers and list pros/cons), analyzes the competition to best meet players expectations.

Can't help you more.

huh

[Boonan]

Kind reminder for the ones that forgot, people like Nadrick joined the staff team end 2011/start 2012, at that time there were 3 servers that were always full.

Yet you’re talking about maintaining high standards when, and I really don’t mean to offend you, you barely experienced one full server for more then 2 weeks. The “standards” you’re talking about are the reason the server is dead, do something, try something. But stop talking like everything is going perfect, it’s the opposite and you know that.

Sure that is great that he was in the Staff team when the server was arguably in its prime however the standards those days aren't really applicable to current times, everything has changed to some extent whether that be through how the system works within the team or attitudes within the community and / or team.


The lack anything during Soul's duration is what created the downward spiral we're currently in (many with a lot more experience and knowledge who are in the know can elaborate more than me) so maintaining the standards that got us in this situation wouldn't be a good idea would it. Hence there has been a lot of change internally, for the better. The current standards have resulted in the biggest series of updates in FL history, changing its landscape entirely to evolve, sure the follow up wasn't ideal - anyone who opposes that is simply delusional - but it gives us something to work towards as a collective, both team and community. Nobody is "talking like everything is going perfect" sure there has been a few positives however the lack of players and player retention unequivocally show that a lot isn't going great and I don't believe anyone has stated that everything 'is going great'? 


Again the point of this thread is for a serious discussion on what the community wants to move forward, instead (like the majority of threads similar to this) it has spiralled into a pointing fingers game, everyone is fine with taking criticism as long as its constructive - notably feedback on what the team can do as a collective and its sub-groups can do to improve ie more dev work on player requested scripts + features, admins clamping down on metagaming (encouraging people to talk in-game rather than in private channels - many are guilty of doing this yet it should be encouraged) etc. Or even better, if people believe they obtain the ability and resources to help FL get out of its current state, applications are still open for contributor, admin and event coordinator.

[Fultz]

The lack anything during Soul's duration is what created the downward spiral we're currently in 

How can you even make a serious comment about that?

Again the point of this thread is for a serious discussion on what the community wants to move forward

Right.

The current standards have resulted in the biggest series of updates in FL history, changing its landscape entirely to evolve

Nobody is "talking like everything is going perfect"

Using the phrase "changing its landscape" and "biggest series of updates in FL history" sound pretty perfect my guy. 

Conn/Management. Is this really the person you want to be your spokesperson?

All Jan said was that Nadrick was an admin back in the day and understands what holding high standards are.

[-DanTheMan-]

Naughty boys in nasty schools
Headmaster's breaking all the rules
Having fun and playing fools
Smashing up the woodwork tools
All the teachers in the pub
Passing 'round the ready-rub
Trying not to think of when
The lunchtime bell will ring again
Oh, what fun we had
But did it really turn out bad
All I learnt at school
Was how to bend, not break the rules
Oh, what fun we had
But at the time it seemed so bad
Trying different ways
To make a difference to
The headmaster's had enough today
All the kids have gone away
Gone to fight with next door's school
Every term, that is the rule
Sits alone and bends his cane
Same old backsides again
All the small ones tell tall tales
Walking home and squashing snails
Oh, what fun we had
But did it really turn out bad
All I learnt at school
Was how to bend, not break the rules
Oh, what fun we had
But at the time it seemed so bad
Trying different ways
To make a difference to the days
Lots of girls and lots of boys
Lots of smells and lots of noise
Playing football in the park
Kicking pushbikes after dark
Baggy trousers, dirty shirt
Pulling hair and eating dirt
Teacher comes to break it up
Back of the 'ead with a plastic cup
Oh, what fun we had
But did it really turn out bad
All I learnt at school
Was how to bend, not break the rules
Oh, what fun we had
But at the time it seemed so bad
Trying different ways
To make a difference to the days
Baggy trousers, baggy trousers, baggy trousers
Baggy trousers, baggy trousers, baggy trousers
Baggy trousers, baggy trousers, baggy trousers
Baggy trousers, baggy trousers, baggy trousers
Baggy trousers, baggy trousers, baggy trousers